Feature Request: Option to disable vsync
Well, it seems like there is a driver issue with Kepler based cards at the moment. In quite a few games vsync doesn't work and that includes with 3d vision. If you look at the Alienbabeltech and pcper GTX690 reviews you can see games that average over 60fps in 3d, meaning that vsync was broken for them as well. This can be annoying but I've found it to be nice in some games. For example I'm playing Hard Reset and I prefer it without vsync. I haven't noticed much screen tearing and the framerate feels smoother. Its clear that its possible to disable vsync in 3d. It would be nice to have the option. I know that SGSSAA came from a driver issue. I'm hoping that maybe we can see a similar option here.

Am I the only one that would be interested in seeing this?
Well, it seems like there is a driver issue with Kepler based cards at the moment. In quite a few games vsync doesn't work and that includes with 3d vision. If you look at the Alienbabeltech and pcper GTX690 reviews you can see games that average over 60fps in 3d, meaning that vsync was broken for them as well. This can be annoying but I've found it to be nice in some games. For example I'm playing Hard Reset and I prefer it without vsync. I haven't noticed much screen tearing and the framerate feels smoother. Its clear that its possible to disable vsync in 3d. It would be nice to have the option. I know that SGSSAA came from a driver issue. I'm hoping that maybe we can see a similar option here.



Am I the only one that would be interested in seeing this?

#1
Posted 05/05/2012 02:52 AM   
3D Vision relies on VSync for 3D. Its intrinsic in the way the driver works.

The glasses shutters have to sync to each frame or 3D just wouldn't work, assuming you have a 120Hz display as most of us do.

Unless there are 240Hz displays, it is impossible to have 3D vision work in anything over 60FPS.

What the nVidia driver does drop the ball on however, is that it generates the same consecutive frame for the other eye.

i.e.

Left Right [i]change[/i] Left Right [i]change[/i] Left Right [i]change[/i] Left Right [i]change[/i] Left Right [i]change[/i]

This forces you to have 60FPS.

In theory, you could have 120fps, but each frame would be different from the last.

Left [i]change[/i] Right [i]change[/i] Left [i]change[/i] Right [i]change[/i] Left [i]change[/i] Right [i]change[/i] Left [i]change[/i] Right [i]change[/i]


I don't know why nVidia doesn't do this. Maybe they just haven't thought of doing it this way.

It would mean that we would see 120FPS.
3D Vision relies on VSync for 3D. Its intrinsic in the way the driver works.



The glasses shutters have to sync to each frame or 3D just wouldn't work, assuming you have a 120Hz display as most of us do.



Unless there are 240Hz displays, it is impossible to have 3D vision work in anything over 60FPS.



What the nVidia driver does drop the ball on however, is that it generates the same consecutive frame for the other eye.



i.e.



Left Right change Left Right change Left Right change Left Right change Left Right change



This forces you to have 60FPS.



In theory, you could have 120fps, but each frame would be different from the last.



Left change Right change Left change Right change Left change Right change Left change Right change





I don't know why nVidia doesn't do this. Maybe they just haven't thought of doing it this way.



It would mean that we would see 120FPS.

i7 920 @ 4GHz, Asus P6T Deluxe V2, 12GB RAM, 2x GTX 670 4GB SLI @ +17% OC, Quad-SSD RevoDrive3 x2 240GB, 10x 15Krpm U320 SCSI RAID0 @ PCIe x4, Modded X-Fi, Dual 1000W PSUs, 2x 2000W ButtKicker LFE, Sennheiser HD650, 2x Revelators, 2x ED glasses, 2x nVidia 3D Vision, DLP Link PGD-150, with CRT, 3D Projector, and iZ3D Monitor.

#2
Posted 05/05/2012 03:08 PM   
That's an interesting idea. Maybe they even tried that with experimental drivers? I'm guessing the problem with that approach is that it would break the fixed offset between the left and right frames and would probably make your eyes pop out though!
That's an interesting idea. Maybe they even tried that with experimental drivers? I'm guessing the problem with that approach is that it would break the fixed offset between the left and right frames and would probably make your eyes pop out though!

GTX 690, I5-2500k ~ 4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, Asus VG236H, Viewsonic PJD 6531W, Samsung LE46 C750, Samsung 830 SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, XFX 850W PSU, Win 7 64

#3
Posted 05/05/2012 09:51 PM   
I wouldn't think that would be the case. Depth and convergence settings should remain the same no matter what. The frames would simply be rendered from pre-defined offsets.

The only reason they might not do it, other than not thinking of it, would be that it may be more comfortable for [i]some[/i] people's eyes to have the same frame displayed to both eyes.

Even if that were true though, limiting to 60fps when one could have 120 is akin to cutting your arm off because you had an itch on your finger.

humm.... ;-)
I wouldn't think that would be the case. Depth and convergence settings should remain the same no matter what. The frames would simply be rendered from pre-defined offsets.



The only reason they might not do it, other than not thinking of it, would be that it may be more comfortable for some people's eyes to have the same frame displayed to both eyes.



Even if that were true though, limiting to 60fps when one could have 120 is akin to cutting your arm off because you had an itch on your finger.



humm.... ;-)

i7 920 @ 4GHz, Asus P6T Deluxe V2, 12GB RAM, 2x GTX 670 4GB SLI @ +17% OC, Quad-SSD RevoDrive3 x2 240GB, 10x 15Krpm U320 SCSI RAID0 @ PCIe x4, Modded X-Fi, Dual 1000W PSUs, 2x 2000W ButtKicker LFE, Sennheiser HD650, 2x Revelators, 2x ED glasses, 2x nVidia 3D Vision, DLP Link PGD-150, with CRT, 3D Projector, and iZ3D Monitor.

#4
Posted 05/06/2012 12:03 AM   
[quote name='RAGEdemon' date='05 May 2012 - 11:08 AM' timestamp='1336230512' post='1404617']
3D Vision relies on VSync for 3D. Its intrinsic in the way the driver works.

The glasses shutters have to sync to each frame or 3D just wouldn't work, assuming you have a 120Hz display as most of us do.


[/quote]

Did you read the first post in the thread? Vsync has been broken with GTX680 since launch and if you don't believe me look at the reviews that I mentioned in the op. 3d vision still works fine other than the occasional screen tearing. It would be nice to have the option since clearly it is possible to use 3d vision without vsync. I just was.
[quote name='RAGEdemon' date='05 May 2012 - 11:08 AM' timestamp='1336230512' post='1404617']

3D Vision relies on VSync for 3D. Its intrinsic in the way the driver works.



The glasses shutters have to sync to each frame or 3D just wouldn't work, assuming you have a 120Hz display as most of us do.









Did you read the first post in the thread? Vsync has been broken with GTX680 since launch and if you don't believe me look at the reviews that I mentioned in the op. 3d vision still works fine other than the occasional screen tearing. It would be nice to have the option since clearly it is possible to use 3d vision without vsync. I just was.

#5
Posted 05/06/2012 02:11 AM   
I did, and I cant see how it would work without VSync. There has to be a mechanism which is keeping the frames in sync for 3D vision to work.

It's perhaps defaulted to trying to do what I menioned in my previous post.

Can you do any benchmarks and make the fps go over 120fps?

I too would love this feature if they can implement it, but your words will probably fall upon deaf ears. People, including myself, have been requesting features for the last 10 years, with not a single one added.

nVidia is known throughout the world as being extremely arrogant when it comes to these things - from the fabs, to vendors, review outlets and down to consumers - the world over.

It's a fantastic idea but it will likely never be done :)
I did, and I cant see how it would work without VSync. There has to be a mechanism which is keeping the frames in sync for 3D vision to work.



It's perhaps defaulted to trying to do what I menioned in my previous post.



Can you do any benchmarks and make the fps go over 120fps?



I too would love this feature if they can implement it, but your words will probably fall upon deaf ears. People, including myself, have been requesting features for the last 10 years, with not a single one added.



nVidia is known throughout the world as being extremely arrogant when it comes to these things - from the fabs, to vendors, review outlets and down to consumers - the world over.



It's a fantastic idea but it will likely never be done :)

i7 920 @ 4GHz, Asus P6T Deluxe V2, 12GB RAM, 2x GTX 670 4GB SLI @ +17% OC, Quad-SSD RevoDrive3 x2 240GB, 10x 15Krpm U320 SCSI RAID0 @ PCIe x4, Modded X-Fi, Dual 1000W PSUs, 2x 2000W ButtKicker LFE, Sennheiser HD650, 2x Revelators, 2x ED glasses, 2x nVidia 3D Vision, DLP Link PGD-150, with CRT, 3D Projector, and iZ3D Monitor.

#6
Posted 05/06/2012 02:40 AM   
It can go over 120..... but I havent found a game where screen tearing wasn't terrible.


baba I cant find many 680 users who use 3d vision. Is your laser sight broken?
It can go over 120..... but I havent found a game where screen tearing wasn't terrible.





baba I cant find many 680 users who use 3d vision. Is your laser sight broken?
[quote name='eqzitara' date='06 May 2012 - 12:42 AM' timestamp='1336279366' post='1404797']
It can go over 120..... but I havent found a game where screen tearing wasn't terrible.


baba I cant find many 680 users who use 3d vision. Is your laser sight broken?
[/quote]

I don't think that its any more broken than normal. What games should I try to test it out? I still see the occasional crosshair doubling in Fallout 3, I'm sure that its still broken older source titles, I just tried out Arma 2 and it didn't work. I did try Skyrim and it appeared to work but I wouldn't be surprised if I saw the occasional double crosshair.

Does Skyrim run like garbage for you in 3d? Framerates for me are much lower than they should be and cpu usage is low.
[quote name='eqzitara' date='06 May 2012 - 12:42 AM' timestamp='1336279366' post='1404797']

It can go over 120..... but I havent found a game where screen tearing wasn't terrible.





baba I cant find many 680 users who use 3d vision. Is your laser sight broken?





I don't think that its any more broken than normal. What games should I try to test it out? I still see the occasional crosshair doubling in Fallout 3, I'm sure that its still broken older source titles, I just tried out Arma 2 and it didn't work. I did try Skyrim and it appeared to work but I wouldn't be surprised if I saw the occasional double crosshair.



Does Skyrim run like garbage for you in 3d? Framerates for me are much lower than they should be and cpu usage is low.

#8
Posted 05/06/2012 01:32 PM   
Almost all game runs like garbage on a single 680 for me tbh(in 3d). Im not sure if you saw my post but I was losing around 60-65 perc fps when going 3d. I will reinstall skyrim and check though tomm got some stuff on my plate today.
Almost all game runs like garbage on a single 680 for me tbh(in 3d). Im not sure if you saw my post but I was losing around 60-65 perc fps when going 3d. I will reinstall skyrim and check though tomm got some stuff on my plate today.
I was getting crappy performance with my new cards at first also. I remember doing a clean install of the drivers and making sure the regular vsync was disabled. After that my performance improved to what I expected over my old 480 GTX cards. I also recommend forcing maximum performance in the power settings and installing Precision X if you haven't done so already.
I was getting crappy performance with my new cards at first also. I remember doing a clean install of the drivers and making sure the regular vsync was disabled. After that my performance improved to what I expected over my old 480 GTX cards. I also recommend forcing maximum performance in the power settings and installing Precision X if you haven't done so already.

#10
Posted 05/06/2012 04:23 PM   
[quote name='eqzitara' date='06 May 2012 - 11:07 AM' timestamp='1336316864' post='1404902']
Almost all game runs like garbage on a single 680 for me tbh(in 3d). Im not sure if you saw my post but I was losing around 60-65 perc fps when going 3d. I will reinstall skyrim and check though tomm got some stuff on my plate today.
[/quote]

Thanks, I'll be interested to see how it runs for you. I'm losing at least 60% in Riften right now while sitting with low cpu usage. I'm using the GTX690 driver right now.


[quote name='Arioch' date='06 May 2012 - 12:23 PM' timestamp='1336321398' post='1404914']
I was getting crappy performance with my new cards at first also. I remember doing a clean install of the drivers and making sure the regular vsync was disabled. After that my performance improved to what I expected over my old 480 GTX cards. I also recommend forcing maximum performance in the power settings and installing Precision X if you haven't done so already.
[/quote]

Yeah, I tried forcing vsync off in the control panel and using adaptive vsync and performance is still off in Skyrim. I'll give it a shot in a couple of other games though.
[quote name='eqzitara' date='06 May 2012 - 11:07 AM' timestamp='1336316864' post='1404902']

Almost all game runs like garbage on a single 680 for me tbh(in 3d). Im not sure if you saw my post but I was losing around 60-65 perc fps when going 3d. I will reinstall skyrim and check though tomm got some stuff on my plate today.





Thanks, I'll be interested to see how it runs for you. I'm losing at least 60% in Riften right now while sitting with low cpu usage. I'm using the GTX690 driver right now.





[quote name='Arioch' date='06 May 2012 - 12:23 PM' timestamp='1336321398' post='1404914']

I was getting crappy performance with my new cards at first also. I remember doing a clean install of the drivers and making sure the regular vsync was disabled. After that my performance improved to what I expected over my old 480 GTX cards. I also recommend forcing maximum performance in the power settings and installing Precision X if you haven't done so already.





Yeah, I tried forcing vsync off in the control panel and using adaptive vsync and performance is still off in Skyrim. I'll give it a shot in a couple of other games though.

#11
Posted 05/06/2012 06:48 PM   
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